There’s Nothing Like a Book with Nancy Paulsen

Nancy Paulsen, president and publisher at Nancy Paulsen Books, an imprint of Penguin Young Readers/Penguin Random House, joins Matthew to talk about devote most of your time to the work of bringing books into the world.

Listen along:

About the Publisher: Nancy Paulsen Books

Nancy Paulsen Books launched its first hardcover list in Fall 2011. The imprint publishes approximately thirty books a year and focuses on picture books that are eye-opening and empowering, and fiction from diverse and distinct voices, especially stories that are inventive and emotionally satisfying.

More:

Browse all of Nancy Paulsen Books’ titles and see what’s coming next by visiting www.penguin.com/nancy-paulsen-books-overview.

Learn more about Boyds Mills and their upcoming programs by visiting www.boydsmills.org. 

Transcript:

NOTE: Transcript created by Descript. I've attempted to clean up any typos, grammatical errors, and formatting errors where possible.

Nancy: There's nothing like being with young people too, to just put you in your place and just see, how unjaded they are or can be, and it's really fun. I love when I get to go to a class and read to kids.

Matthew: That is the voice of Nancy Paulsen, president and publisher at Nancy Paulsen Books, an imprint of Penguin Young Readers/Penguin Random House.

Welcome back to the Children’s Book Podcast, where we celebrate the books and creators who help young readers feel seen, supported, and understood. This episode is brought to you in partnership with Boyds Mills, positively impacting kids by amplifying the voices of storytellers who inspire children to become their best selves.

I’m your host, Matthew Winner—teacher, librarian, writer, and a fan of kids.

Today I’m bringing you something a little different: an interview with a publisher. 

Nancy Paulsen Books launched its first hardcover list in Fall 2011. The imprint publishes approximately thirty books a year and focuses on picture books that are eye-opening and empowering, and fiction from diverse and distinct voices, especially stories that are inventive and emotionally satisfying.

You know Nancy’s books and you already love her authors. I know this because these books and these voices are universally loved by readers all around the world, myself included. Think of Lynda Mullaly Hunt’s Fish in a Tree or Padma Venkatramen’s The Bridge Home or Derrick Barnes and Gordon C. James’ I Am Every Good Thing or Ruth Behar’s Lucky Broken Girl any of the moving and lasting works by Jaqueline Woodson, including Brown Girl Dreaming, The Day You Begin, and Each Kindness. 

Here are a few of the things I learned in this conversation: 

NUMBER ONE: Nancy is a full time editor and she loves it. Different publishers take on different roles, playing to their strengths. This is one of Nancy’s great strengths and she likens it to the joy of solving a puzzle. 

NUMBER TWO: Nancy seeks to publish stories she lovingly refers to as “heart-print” books. Those are the stories that leave a mark and that have the potential to stay with you your whole life.

And NUMBER THREE: Nancy loves publishing books that work well when read aloud. This spoke most strongly to me as a teacher. Not all books carry the voice to be read aloud easily or well. Knowing that this is a quality Nancy looks for is evident throughout her catalog of published titles.

Let’s get to know this one publisher’s approach a little better and, while doing so, remind ourselves that there’s nothing like a book!

Please welcome Nancy Paulsen to the podcast.

Nancy: Hello. My name is Nancy Paulsen, and I am president and publisher of Nancy Paulsen Books, which is an imprint at Penguin Young Readers, which is part of Penguin Random House, and that's a mouthful.

But mostly I'm just really a full-time editor. I'm a publisher too, but I edit all day long, when I'm not stuck in meetings. 

Matthew: I would love to make the joke of what a great thing the universe had in store for you that you ended up landing a job at a company n- with your name in it. That was really a great coincidence.

Yeah. 

Nancy: I've only worked for P companies my whole life, you 

Matthew: know? I know, that's actually kinda cool. 

Nancy: Yeah. Puffin, Putnam. 

Matthew: How about it? And how- 

Nancy: Although I did start at [00:01:00] Viking, I have to say. I was an 

Matthew: assistant. You did start at Viking. Yeah. At Viking. I was aware of that. Before we go deeper into your career, Nancy, I'd love to just ask you what's giving you hope today?

Nancy: The same thing that's always given me hope, I think, and it's authors with these unique and fascinating stories to tell, learning about, like walking in somebody else's shoes. Just the magic of being transported to another place, there, there's nothing like a book to take you out of yourself and to learn about the world.

Matthew: Isn't that the truth? When did you s- first feel that, there's nothing like a book? Is that- When 

Nancy: I was a little- ... from childhood? ... kid, yeah. No kidding. I 

Matthew: mean, 

Nancy: my mother would take us to the library every week, and we would just stock up. And my brother called me Nancy Pooh 'cause I read Winnie-the-Pooh so many times.

That was one of the first books I tried to read myself, and that is not an easy one. 

Matthew: That's not an easy one. What 

Nancy: a beautiful book. And my sweet mother just kept on telling me [00:02:00] what those words were and cracking up with me. Lots of great memories of libraries and such. 

Matthew: What a privilege to be able to stay in that world- 

Nancy: Totally

Matthew: like for the rest of 

Nancy: your life. What a 

Matthew: great privilege. 

Nancy: Yes. Yeah. And when I started I applied for a job at Viking, like a year out of college, and I didn't know what department it was. I walked in, I didn't know what the opening was, and they said, "Oh, we have an opening in children's books." And as I walked in I saw, Madeline and Snowy Day and- Yeah

Corduroy and, Pippi Long- just like everything. And that was the job, and I got offered the job that day, and I was like, "Oh, my God." And I haven't stopped working since. 

Matthew: Oh, that's so cool. I love talking to folks on here about what draws them... In the, in, in teaching we also have the same thing of why teach elementary?

Why write for children? Why write picture books? Why write YA or writing for all- And it's, it never ceases to, I think, delight me that we all have these [00:03:00] different connections that mean something. Whether or not there, there's such a direct line or if it's just a feeling of, no, it feels like home to be around children's books or working, for me, in the elementary school library.

It just is... It's a neat thing that we all find our way, don't we? 

Nancy: It is. And there's nothing like being with young people too, to just- 

Matthew: That's the truth ... 

Nancy: put you in your place and just see, how unjaded they are or can be, and it's really fun. I love when I get to go to a class and read to kids.

Matthew: Ah. I have the great privilege of talking to you through this lens of your experience. I cannot wait to pick your brain. But why don't you first help me understand what a day or week looks like in your role as president and publisher. I know it's not all- Yeah ... the same, but what does it normally look like?

Nancy: At this point, now that I have my own imprint, I have a small team, which is good. I'm not managing a lot of people. Oh. But I have an art department I work with, and I have an- another editor and an assistant who I work with. [00:04:00] So I really get to devote most of my time to the work. And I keep Mondays and Fridays meetings-free so that I can actually focus on editing.

I edit too many weekends, but I think every editor will tell you that. But I love it because it's editing a book is like figuring out a puzzle, and everything I know I've learned from children's books. It's that sort of thing. It's fascinating. But a typical day, in the middle of the week where there are meetings, it's a lot of email.

It's a lot of, stuff. We just had launch last week, so it was two weeks of getting, title information sheets together and presentations together and and there's always flap copy and author correspon- there's just a lot of s- that kind of stuff too. But I do get to to devote a fair amount of time to the editing, and I work from home most of the time.

I only go into the city now o- probably once a week. 

Matthew: Okay. So let me ask you, knowing that there's a lot of storytellers, writers, [00:05:00] illustrators that listen, how- I love that you're, that you said editing is like a puzzle to you. And, and clearly you like puzzles. It's not- Yeah. "Editing is like a puzzle, and wow do I hate puzzles."

No. But, 

Nancy: I don't do jigsaws- ... but I like the puzzle of a book. Like- Love that ... did that chapter really go there, or whatever. 

Matthew: So that actually ties right into what I was gonna ask. How do you know what feels like a book that, that you'd like to offer to, to publish? Is it that... it's clearly it sounds like it's not all solved, but you're able to see a bigger picture and see what the intention is.

Is that fair to say? 

Nancy: Yeah, it's always everybody will say it's the voice, it's that. 

Matthew: Okay. 

Nancy: But it's also the, the arc of the story. Is there enough meat in it that if I was 10 I would wanna read it, I think we all have that inner kid in us. And, I'm working on a new book with Sheila Moses, and it starts with a, a kid, this is set in the '50s it's called Ollie's Haint Blues, and it's about [00:06:00] that blue that's painted in South Carolina you see it on the top of porches, and it's meant to keep the spirits out, and it's a Gullah thing.

And I kinda knew that tradition from being in Charleston, but this book starts with this young girl being left at the train station by her stepmother, and the wicked- ... not a good stepmother, this one. And this lovely old Black woman takes her to this house where they've raised lots of orphan kids.

And you're just sucked into the story, and it's about how she thinks these, the spirits are gonna protect her, but it's really the love that is represented by the people who believe in the custom, so it's just this moving, charming story. I think most of the books I work on, I like to keep them short.

I only do middle grade and picture books. I don't do YA. So my middle grade, the whole thing is keeping it short, pacey, short chapters, and, page turning. So each chapter is y- they're perfect read alouds in the [00:07:00] classroom. Oh, yeah. And they've had lots of global read. My authors have had lots of global read alouds.

Matthew: Yeah. I've had those authors on this show. Not even knowing that w- was gonna happen, but I know... i'm seeing behind you Fish In a Tree, and you know that I'm quite a fan of- Yes ... Linda. I think you and I have shared together that I'm... I know that Linda knows that I'm quite a fan of Linda and her teacher heart, and how she really sees teachers.

Absolutely. But also Padma Venkatraman, and also Tori Maldonado and many others. You're right, that just feel- And feel like even though in schools I think that read aloud time in some pockets of our country is being threatened, there's really nothing that brings us together quite like being read to.

Yes. And being read to in community is a special thing too. 

Nancy: When Colby tells me his kids love a book, I'm like, "Colby Sharp," it's so fabulous, we're all like, "That makes her day." 

Matthew: Yeah. It's a neat thing. You make books not knowing. You can practice them, you can try them out, but to [00:08:00] have them really in front of children is, is- We're great-

it's why we do 

Nancy: it ... we're great readers aloud. And on picture books, my art director and I, every ti- and the designer, every time a round comes in, we read the text through- Yeah ... aloud. We take turns reading it. We listen. And we're constantly, finessing it until, till the bitter end pretty much.

And sometimes the author's like, "I thought this went into copy." And we're like, "Yeah, it did," but, it's a picture book. We fiddle as the art comes in. It's, and, everybody gets that now. But I think reading aloud really does give you such a sense of the power of the words and the poetry of the words.

Matthew: I think that's great, and how else would you know the drama of the story? You can have the drama in your head, but really when we perform that book- Yeah ... when we as librarians and teachers perform that book in that space- It's different from when we read it in our heads so great. It probably is also why your books work so well in audio because you're- I think so, too

you're being [00:09:00] used to that m- spoken word. 

Nancy: Yeah. 

Matthew: Cool. So you've been at this your whole career. How do you measure success of a book, success of your role, success of this imprint? I- there's a lot of different- I 

Nancy: think- ... I 

Matthew: guess, pockets for success ... 

Nancy: it's keeping the books o- most of my books backlist, you 

Matthew: know?

Oh, 

Nancy: good. They reprint and they backlist. They win a lot of state awards, and to me, I love s- those state awards are the best. A 

Matthew: lot of the- And Nancy, so many kids read when it's a state award. So many. 

Nancy: Yeah, and a lot of them kids vote for themsel- are actually doing the voting. They do. So yeah.

So those state awards, every time I have a launch, I list all the state awards, starfish and then Boom, the new book by Lisa- By Lisa Yee ... that's is up to f- 15 state awards already, and it's not even in paperback. So we announce that and just Padma's newest one, Safe Harbor, is- in- still in [00:10:00] hardcover and got lots of state awards.

So there are, those start cranking, and that is something that is really joyful to all of us. 

Matthew: That's terrific. In Maryland, we have the Black-Eyed Susan Book Award. Yeah. Which m- when you look across the, the nation you've got two ways that it's done, and ours falls into that camp of a group of librarians select a set of nominees, and then the students read all year sometimes being read to, reading the books aloud or sometimes reading them on their own.

And then they vote in April for School Library Month. And that's a neat thing to have a collection of books that, that we can bond over or really for new librarians as well- To be given a set of here's great books to keep adding to your collection, like a starter sets, if you will.

And it's really neat because then your books get put into groups where we're really trying to select titles that reach a wide, wide- Yeah ... interest of readers. So that's cool. That... neat to know that you watch [00:11:00] for those, those backlist polls. Oh, 

Nancy: totally. Totally. The big awards are nice, too, but, they're a crap shoot, and I try not to...

when an author says, "Oh, I'm a mock this," I'm like, "That's nice," "don't get too excited." Yeah. And, but your book is doing really well, and we're really happy with it you've already won. We're doing good, 

Matthew: you've already won. Y- you've been held by a reader. Yeah. Your book has been held by a reader.

You've already 

Nancy: won. Oh, my goodness. I know, and there's so many. A, a lot of them will sh- my authors share the letters they get, and they're just... you can't... that, getting that kind of, Response from a child who is touched or who is, like you were saying, sees themself in a book. We all talk about that as being important, but when you get those letters, you just realize how important it is.

Matthew: And Nancy, you know just as well too that for all the letters you do receive, there's countless of kids- Yeah ... that haven't written, because we as adults don't write thank you letters to everyone we're grateful [00:12:00] for. Of course not. It really takes that big feeling or that, that push from someone else in your life to write that letter.

So being able to have someone like you on the other end- It's okay. We don't need more letters anyhow. 

You don't need more. No. But to know- No, I know 

Nancy: what you're saying ... 

Matthew: each letter is representative- yes ... of a lot of children. 

Nancy: Yes. We used to actually, back in the day, there was somebody who would send all those letters to put it with snail mail.

Oh that's so cool. That was a whole job just to like- Just 

Matthew: your box of letters? 

Nancy: Oh my God. Whoa. Tomie dePaola would get a, a room full every day. Tomie 

Matthew: would... That's incredible. 

Nancy: Yeah. 

Matthew: If it's also because of publishing great books and being prolific, but also wasn't Tomie, didn't Mr.

Rogers speak to Tomie? I feel like I know Mr. Rogers- yes ... spoke to a lot of authors. And so if, if- And Barney. Oh, there you go. And Barney. So I'll say, if our guy Mr. Rogers talked to a bunch of people, of course we're gonna go find their books. 

Nancy: Of course. 

Matthew: Yeah. 

Nancy: Of course. 

Matthew: Lovely. So Nancy, what made you say yes to this imprint?

I know it's been going now for a while. I think I read on your site, it was like you published maybe your first book in 2011 or [00:13:00] something. Yeah. But you've been in publishing for a while. Is this something you were working toward or just something that was proven or? It w- it was 

Nancy: definitely, I was tired of managing big departments, and I always edited while I managed, while I was running Puffin and then Putnam.

But I'd only have time to do a handful of books, and that was what I loved. I always edited Jacqueline Woodson myself, there, I wasn't gonna give up these authors who gave me great joy to edit. 

Matthew: Yeah. 

Nancy: And then I just got to the point where I wa- I wanted to really focus on pure, the pure editing.

Matthew: Is publishing more made up of imprints now, or is it- Is it still there's this big... 

Nancy: What was the- The imprints are pretty big. 

Matthew: Okay. I 

Nancy: mean, Putnam is really big. Viking is really big. Laurie Hornick started a beautiful imprint called Rocky Pond Books. [00:14:00] 

Matthew: Rocky 

Nancy: Pond, yeah. And she's doing a lot of books that are, ha- m- have mental health themes.

They're... She's doing a great job. So she's a small department. At the time when I started, I was probably one of the only people in the division doing diver- multicultural, whatever they were calling it back then. Okay. But I had a... Most of my authors were people of color. And that just happened naturally.

I was interested in the stories, and more submissions came to me, and that was a niche I had. But that wasn't... I just... I was open to different stories, but I really did focus in on the middle grade and the shorter middle grade, and that was, what was working. When Linda, when I got Linda Mullaly Hunt's first book, One for the Murphys that was...

I met her at an NCTE party that I crashed. 

Matthew: Oh. 

Nancy: It was when bloggers were just starting to happen, and I was coming- Oh ... down the escalator at some NCTE or another, and there was a party in a bar. So I went over, and I saw her agent. We were chatting, [00:15:00] and she said, "This is Linda. She has a book." And Linda says, "Yeah, everybody's rejected it."

And I said send it to me." And it was One for the Murphys, and I read it, and I loved it. And sh- 

Matthew: Aw. 

Nancy: And Erin was saying, "Oh, people were saying it's too quiet." It's the most moving foster kid story- Yeah ... you can imagine. It's beautiful. And it's like, how could anybody say this is a quiet book? If you're 10, this is an earth-shattering book.

Matthew: Yeah. That's good perspective on that. Yeah. You your description of the imprint talks about distinct voices and emotionally satisfying stories. W- what are some of those books? I for people that aren't familiar with your imprint- Sure ... what are some of those books that you've helped to bring to readers?

And I'd also love to know what books have made an imprint on you, because I know you, too, are a reader. 

Nancy: One of the things I do love that a lot of teachers say, when they say, "It's a Nancy Paulsen book," it's a heart print book because it has hope. Heart print. It [00:16:00] ha- it's hard.

There are hard times, but there is hope. It's that mixture. And I think, oh, I love Padma's, I have it up there. The Bridge Home. Bridge Home. Yeah that is a story about these girls who have to fend for themselves on the street of Chennai in India. But they meet two boys who are doing the same thing, and they become a little family of sorts.

And the banter and the dialogue when these kids are talking about God and what... "god, what does he think of us?" And they're outcasts, but she just has so much humor in these stories that even though they're sad, you're like, "These kids are so freaking spirited and nothing's gonna keep them down."

Some things might keep them down but they try their hardest to keep going. And you just admire the guts. And I think, Linda Mullaly Hunt's a great one for that too. Her new book is gonna blow you away. We just put it into copy editing. It's called How to Build a [00:17:00] Miracle.

Matthew: Congratulations to her. That's great. 

Nancy: And that's that's a story about a, a kid who's going through grief. His, he's lost a brother, and he starts really acting out. He thinks he should've been able to save him. They were hockey players, and they were in the woods. And he just starts doing really stupid things, and finds himself in front of a judge.

He's made some dumb decisions, and gets sent to this juvenile camp for the summer where they're rebuilding boats and rebuilding themselves, and there's a great guy there who's gives them tools for these things. But it's got Linda's heart. It's got sass. It's got all that stuff.

And it's, it, she like purposely, the kid calls himself Shakespeare so it's, he knows he's living a metaphor, he's like very clever that way. 

Matthew: Nancy I know from my time in publishing that sometimes, an agent will help get your book in front of different editors through the submissions.

But then sometimes after you sell a book, you may [00:18:00] start working with that editor more in the future. Have you maybe because maybe part of the agreement is that the editor would like, I don't know, right of first refusal or maybe it's just a great working relationship. Can you- ... tell me a little bit about how that- It w-

has developed for you? 

Nancy: A, a lot of contracts, the publishing, publisher tries to get options for the next book. To me, I'm not a stickler about that. I'm like, I w- if they wanna work with me and I wanna keep working with them, we're gonna keep working together. 

Matthew: Cool. 

Nancy: That, that option that says, "You gotta show it to her," doesn't mean, that's not what it's about to me.

I- 

Matthew: But there are some that, that do that. There are. I don't mean to be so ignorant. I just don't know. 

Nancy: Yes, there are. Okay. And a lot of people fight over that and stuff. And, Oh, okay ... it's just one of those things I don't, it doesn't, like I said, I just feel like- We, almost everybody I work with, we keep on keeping on.

I've been publishing Jacqueline Woodson for 30 years. Yeah. Aisha Saeed, Padma, Varsha [00:19:00] Bajaj. Varsha. Yeah, I see Varsha's book up there. Oh, her new book is so good. Roar. Is Roar great? I'm, I look forward to listening to it on audio. I saw it just came in. Oh, good. Yeah. That will take you to a, to a tiger sanctuary in India.

Matthew: Oh. 

Nancy: A kid from Houston goes to visit his grandparents there, and she actually has chapters interspersed that are set in the jungle, and she does it so well. The voice, the, the thoughts of the tiger and the crow. It's really magical. 

Matthew: I'll... It'll be my next one, Nancy. It doesn't take much to, to-

book talk to me. I am, I'm very influential. Very easily influenced. That- 

Nancy: But yeah. And as far as signing up I'm not a big auction person. So a lot of- Oh, okay ... publishing, especially in young adult, it's, it... and especially in the past few years, it's like every author was being auctioned by an agent.

And then I watch the situation. Lots of money gets paid. Very few books can earn out that kind of [00:20:00] big- Oh ... big money. So is this, does it look like a successful story or not? 

Matthew: Okay. 

Nancy: It's, and it can be disappointing. So ev- most agents know I'm allergic to auctions. And I have enough stuff coming to me that I'm in a lu- very lucky position now, okay. Because I've been at it a long time, and the rep- I have the reputation. So if people come to me, it's basically 'cause the author wants... ruth Behar came to me with Lucky Broken Girl- Ruth. ... because of Brown Girl Dreaming. She's like, "I have a, a, s- a book that's almost a memoir too." It, I, and I'm, I try to do very fair contracts where I base it on what I think we're going to sell, and then we put bonuses in.

So it's a way of working that sort of we're all in this together, and we're not... I never feel like, oh, we s- we paid so much, and then it didn't pan out, and now we can't work with you anymore. I hate that style of publishing. 

Matthew: Yeah. I think that- [00:21:00] Publishing is interesting, right?

Because we don't quite know everything that you're doing. You're writing a book but it, you can't just be a writer. You also have to have a little bit of savvy with how the contracts are gonna work, and what is- 

Nancy: Yeah ... 

Matthew: the right person to work with, and what does author visits look like, and all these different things.

So it's I think it helps to hear as many voices as we can to just be able to discern, to know that there's many ways through publishing, and your way is one way and another way is another way. But also, there's many people in publishing. And so- Yes ... finding... i've been through the journey of finding the right agent for me, knowing that we don't all fit, just like you're not- Yeah.

So true ... I'm not gonna get along with all my colleagues at school. That doesn't mean that I don't respect all my colleagues at school, but just that I'll probably not collaborate the same way with each one of them. Sure ... but, hopefully the people listening are getting a sense that you are one of the ways that, that editors work with folks and, 

Nancy: and- Yeah.

And one of the things that i- is really important I, for keeping a [00:22:00] book in print for my authors, is they do a lot of school visits, and that's why we care so much about read aloud and all that kind of thing. Yeah. So some of them do it themselves. Some of them have, work through agencies that help them.

And they sell a lot of their books through the schools, through their school visits. That really helps keep a book in print. Book- bookstores just, they move on to the next front list. They'll keep some back lists. 

Matthew: Yeah. 

Nancy: But that is the key to success for most of my authors. 

Matthew: The libraries will keep books on shelves for, if it's a fiction book, we'll keep them on the shelf for 20 or 30 years.

And- Yeah. ... it's neat when the person visits because then you just wanna keep checking out their books and keep checking out their books, and that's really neat. But you also have with Padma she visited my school whenever NCT was like last in Baltimore. It was probably- Yeah ... eight or 10 years ago.

And we made it that the entire grade read [00:23:00] the book together. Oh. And so we had a book club with the book. Oh, nice. And that was a neat thing, too. So it's neat to have books like that, that it's not just having the author come in and talk about craft and talk about writing, and that's really cool, but also to have a shared experience like that.

So it, it, neat to know. I, you're, I think, the first publisher I've talked to, not that I've talked to a ton, but you're the first person I've talked to that's really talked about the care of a book's life in that space. That's neat. 

Nancy: It's really important. The other thing that's happening, I do a lot of books in verse, and so- Oh, yeah

right now, we just had our launch last week, and both Aisha Saeed and Ruth Behar have their first novels in verse coming out. 

Matthew: And- Oh, I know Aisha had one coming out. Oh, that's exciting. 

Nancy: Yes. Yes. 

Matthew: Ruth, I, I keep track of Ruth. Ruth is a good one. But Aisha- Yeah ... I, that makes me very excited. 

Nancy: And Aisha's is gonna keep you on the edge of your seat.

It's about- Oh ... it's about these kids in Pakistan who who are on... There's a thing called [00:24:00] a dolly, which is like a homemade gondola that they build to get from town to town so they don't have to hike over the mountains. These- the book's set at the foothills of the Himalayas, and these things break at, down all the time 'cause they're just makeshift contraptions that the town puts together.

And so it's a survival story. These kids get stuck on it on the way to school, and it's got a lot of heart, a lot going on. 

Matthew: Nancy, would you be a librarian in another life? You book talk so- ... with so much passion. You'd be a great librarian in another life. I would love to 

Nancy: be a librarian, honestly.

Matthew: Yeah. 

Nancy: That would be a great job. 

Matthew: But thank goodness there's so many great jobs with children, and you're in one of them. Yes. That's great that so many of us get to be part of their village. Yeah. But listen, I've had a blast talking to you. I'm so grateful that we connected this way.

Really got to sit down not in a noisy, Yes ... conference bar, but this is a little- 

Nancy: We'll do that another time ... 

Matthew: another time. A little easier for me to hear you now. This is great. Yes. I wanna close our [00:25:00] time by asking you that I will see a library full of children tomorrow morning. Is there a message that I can bring to them from you?

Nancy: Huh. Let me see. I would say... Okay. I love to travel. There's nothing like travel. With books you can be an armchair traveler. You can go other places. You can meet other kids your age who are navigating this crazy, or I should say this confusing world.

And you can go to India and vacation at a tiger sanctuary and roar. You can go to the beaches with, in Safe Harbor and rescue a seal. You can subway surf in Tori's book in New York City and almost get killed. But really you can just open your mind, broaden your horizons, check out a few other lifestyles, and maybe it will help you figure out what you wanna do in your own life.

Matthew: Thank you to Nancy Paulsen for joining me on the Children’s Book Podcast. 

You can browse all of the Nancy Paulsen Books titles and see what’s coming next by visiting www.penguin.com/nancy-paulsen-books-overview.  

Our podcast logo was created by Duke Stebbins (https://stebs.design/). 

Our music is by Podington Bear. 

Podcast hosting by Libsyn. 

You can support the show and buy me a coffee at matthewcwinner.com or by clicking the link in the show notes.

And on that note…

Be well. And read on.